Thursday, January 07, 2010

Eco-government: "the democratic process does not work"

As regular readers will know, your humble Devil is not a massive fan of democracy. However, whilst I object to its fetishisation—democracy is not the endpoint, it is only a method of trying to maintain liberty—I do recognise that it is the least-worst system that we have so far invented.

Via Bishop Hill, as Nico Stehr and Hans von Storch helpfully point out it seems that many AGW alarmists simply don't agree: after all, democracy is so very inconvenient because a lot of the time people won't do what you tell them, eh? [Emphasis mine.]
...the times are changing. Within the broad field of climatology and climate policy one is able to discern growing concerns about the virtues of democracy... it is an inconvenient democracy, which is identified as the culprit holding back action on climate change. As Mike Hulme has noted, it can be frustrating to learn that citizens have minds of their own.

Leading climate scientists insist that humanity is at a crossroads. A continuation of present economic and political trends leads to disaster if not collapse. To create a globally sustainable way of life, we immediately need in the words of German climate scientist Hans Joachim Schellnhuber, a "great transformation." What exactly is meant by the statement is vague. Part, if not the heart of this great transformation is in the eyes of some climate scientists as well as other scientists part of the great debate about climate change a new political regime and forms of governance: "We need an authoritarian form of government in order to implement the scientific consensus on greenhouse gas emissions" according to the Australian scholars David Shearman and Joseph Wayne Smith their book The Climate Change Challenge and the Failure of Democracy. The well-known climate researcher James Hansen adds resignedly and frustrated as well as vaguely, "the democratic process does not work". In The Vanishing Face of Gaia, James Lovelock emphasizes that we need to abandon democracy in order to meet the challenges of climate change head on. We are in a state of war. In order to pull the world out of its state of lethargy, the equivalent of a global warming "nothing but blood, toil, tears and sweat" speech is urgently needed.

If I were the AGW alarmists, I wouldn't worry about it too much: democracy is little more than a fig-leaf these days anyway, especially since a fucking court ruling decided that manifesto pledges are not subject to legitimate expectation.

P.S. The above article was written by Nico Stehr and Hans von Storch; the latter was one of those mentioned in the CRU emails—specifically this one, written by Andy Revkin to Tim Osborn.
by the way, von storch doesn't concur with osborn/briffa on the idea that
higher past variability would mean there'd likley be high future
variability as well (bigger response to ghg forcing).
he simply says it's time to toss hockeystick and start again, doesn't take
it further than that.

Von Storch was also one of those who called for Mann and Jones to be banned from making any contribution to future IPCC reviews.


Anonymous said...

This is not entirely unexpected.
In fact, it's the Herald of something I've been expecting for quite a long time now: namely the realisation from the Moonbats that they aren't going to get what they want through democratic means.
They had a good run at it, but the public are slowly wising up.
I've been predicting -- to anyone who'll listen -- that the green movement is roughly where the extreme left was in the mid-60s prior to the rise of left terrorism. That idealism for their 'perfect' world is about to receive an ugly reality check.
What I'm expecting to emerge over the coming years is the green equivalent of the Baader-Meinhof gang. This will happen when the Greens realise that they've been rumbled, and are just not going to get what they want. Democracy hasn't worked, protest won't work, Entryism hasn't worked, subverting the political process hasn't worked, seducing politicians hasn't worked, realigning the media hasn't worked, in fact, nothing has worked.
When they realise that, expect the bullets and bombs to begin.

Jiks said...

Only slightly (I hope) off topic, the politisation of the Met Office is getting ridiculous. Tonight for example they are forcasting a minimum -5 C for Pershore, Worcestershire, while Meteogroup go for -14 C. It was already -7 at 1500... This has been a consistant pattern throughout the current cold spell.

I can understand "adjusting" the figures after everyone has forgotten and the "OMG it will be the hottest year ever!!11" long term forecasts but actually reporting junk figures live as it were seems a bit cheeky and rather too obvious.

However they have a vested interest in warming I guess so hence this nonsense...

Katabasis said...

Welcome to the world of Post Normal Science

IncrediblySustainableOrganism said...

Mr.Devil, I enjoy your blogging very much indeed. Keep up the good work.

It's the begining of shining era defined by 'governance of knowledge', and if one disagrees, Soviet-style solution it is then (and no I'm not talking about competative ice skating in mid-80's).

Theoretical framework is dutifuly provided by one Jerome Ravetz, whom Wiki describes as a 'fellow traveller' .

Mr. Ravetz famously declared that "the puzzle-solving approach of ‘normal science’ is obsolete. This is a drastic cultural change for science, which many scientists will find difficult to accept. But there is no turning back; we can understand post-normal science as the extension of democracy appropriate to the conditions of our age."

Ravetz. Post-normal science. Look it up. Best to all.

Atlas shrugged said...

When they realise that, expect the bullets and bombs to begin.

What planet have you been living on? The bullets, and bombs have already started.

The creation of a planetary government is at a far more advanced stage then all but myself have bothered to tell you.

You are right that the proverbial THEY are still a long way away from convincing the majority of the great unwashed of its merits. Which is mainly because THEY gave up trying to do so, many years ago.

Try your best to understand that the powers that ultimately control capitalism/corporatism are EXACTLY the same powers that invented and control socialism/communism. This is the reason why THEY are still where they are, and why we will forever be where they very much wish to keep US. Also a very BIG reason why the world has become far more communist, corporatist and horrendously authoritarian, since the so called fall of the Soviet Union, then it ever was before it apparently did so.

Even Libertarianism was mainly invented by these mega powerful and subversive elements, and those parts of Libertarianism that were not, were swiftly subverted by them shortly after the last world war, by people like Ayn Rand, and her co-agitators.

Therefore EVERY known political ideology under THEIR sun god, very much including revolutionary Marxism, was wholly subverted way before you were a twinkle in your mothers eye.

My natural sense of self preservation forbids me from naming names. However it really is not difficult to find out where this power ultimately comes from, and who it ultimately works for. A clue would be that it has very little or indeed nothing whatsoever to do with Jews, or Judaism.

My advice is to stop following establishment sponsored ISMS, and try to start regaining your God given common sense based humanity ASAP.

Anonymous said...

We "sceptics" as they like to call us, still have a battle on our hands. The following letter appeared in a local newspaper in Norwich today:

After a disastrous 2009, the new year offers new hope in many respects. And while the UN climate talks in Copenhagen ended with a "historic cop-out", as Oxfam describes it, there is much reason to believe that 2010 will be different.
The politicians meeting in Denmark's capital may have huffed, puffed, squabbled and gesticulated, but tens of thousands of ordinary people like me gathered there with a common purpose: solving this climate crisis. We had no other interest besides solving a global problem threatening us all - including us in Norfolk.
The so-called "Copenhagen Accord" stated "the desire to keep warming below two degrees", but put in place no commitment, and no method by which to do so. As one observer commented: "If the climate were a bank it would have been saved: not abandoned to the brutality of the market."
If temperatures increase two degrees, it will cause sea levels to rise by more than two metres - swamping the Norfolk Broads, flooding the Thames Estuary and inundating our south-eastern coastline. London, Portsmouth, and much of Kent will need vast new flood defences.
But at least we have the resources to protect ourselves. In developing countries, 300,000 people are dying every year from increased drought, severe flooding, water and food shortages and tropical storms. So, as campaigners like me gathered at Copenhagen, we knew that time was running out.
While the UN summit ended in failure, our own "Peoples Summit" was a success. In solidarity, in unity, fighting for a common cause, we built huge momentum for the future. We protested, we networked, discussed real solutions and produced better outcomes on our own than any politician could manage.
We realised that 2009 was not the end but just the beginning. It saw the world's biggest demonstration against climate change. It saw 1.5 million people gather at Oxfam's climate hearings held all over the world, to testify against the global warming impacts they are feeling right now. The summit at Copenhagen, far from weakening our resolve, made us stronger. So, we go forward into 2010 knowing that while there is work still to do, in order to get the fair and safe global deal we all need, and while a fresh approach and new direction is called for, we are better placed and better equipped to succeed than ever before.

James Cracknell, Oxfam campaigner for Norfolk.

I noted the term "Common Purpose" slipped in near the beginning - why am I not surprised?

Oxfam gets significant funding from HM government and the EU - source
So, once again, they use our money to campaign for their own agenda.

Sadly I won't be wasting any time trying to rebuff this propaganda, as the paper has refused to publish any "alternative" views to the "settled science" line.

Anonymous said...

Keep it up DK (ooh errr).

Keep roaring bloggers they will have to listen very, very soon.

Let's just hope they are all hanging from the lamposts before they get the chance to kill the blogosphere.

Jeff Wood said...

The anonymous first commenter made the same point as I would have made, almost word for word including the reference to the Baader-Meinhof gang.

I was around at the end of the Sixties, and recall quite vividly the anger in some minds, and I see it again today in the Greenies.

Probably, I am less sure than Anon, but not much less.

David Davis (Libertarian Alliance) said...

In the early 1980s, when i knew some early chappies and chapesses who belonged to whatever it was that jenkins, williams, David steel and that owen guy set up, they often said "if we come to power, we will "HAVE TO RULE BY DECREE".

They were very nice middle class people, with children, mortgages and cars and stuff. They were merely impatient with the general world's inability to see that they were totally right, and that what had to be done, er, had to be done.

In Germany in 1933, they and their sort would have been Nazis. They were the same people who kept quiet when the Jews all disappeared, and when Austria and Czechslovakia were overwhelmed. And who still might have protested, just, a bit, when "die Ermachtigungsgesetz" was "decreed" in late March 1933.

Frank Davis said...

Daavid Davis wrote: They were merely impatient

I once read that the Russian revolutionaries a decade or two earlier were impatient for change that wasn't happening fast enough for them.

DocBud said...

You might like to meet one of your future leaders:,23739,22383639-27197,00.html

"This is because the implications of 3C, let alone 4C or 5C, are so horrible that we look to any possible scenario to head it off, including the canvassing of "emergency" responses such as the suspension of democratic processes."

Fortunately, for all of us, we have it from the highest authority that he is a public intellectual:

As you can see from this little gem:

"So I think where we're going is to begin to see a Gaian earth in its ecological, cybernetic way, infused with some notion of mind or soul or chi, which will transform our attitudes to it away from an instrumentalist one, towards an attitude of greater reverence. I mean, the truth is, unless we do that, I mean we seriously are in trouble, because we know that Gaia is revolting against the impact of human beings on it."

Oh, and he recently was soundly rejected by the electorate in the seat of Higgins so will probably be keener than ever to stop the great unwashed from interfering in his need to force us to live as he decrees:

Polaris said...

Mann, Jones, NASA the Met Office and the attavistic green movement generally appear to have the political instincts of Mugabe. Brook no dissent, no compromise and no open peer review - it's all settled and you'd better accept their interpretation. Hell mend you if you haven't graduated in a subject that includes the words climate or environment - you aren't even entitled to opine.

If you wish to subjugate a population, convince them of impending doom, ignore the naysayers and take advantage of their dependency on you to protect them - democracy plays no part in that process, elections are just a damned inconvenience.

stevie said...

AGW is the new creationism>

Roy G Davis said...

So, the religious war will soon begin. Those that believe, against those that don't. And the people in the middle (read: "the man in the street") will likely to be shafted by it all.

Antipholus Papps said...

Don't forget that the modern Green Party has it's roots in the NSDAP:

Wormsnapper said...

I see they're still waffling out their, "the weather is not climate" bullshit. How about:

Street crime is not the game Grand Theft Auto; the former happens in the real world to real people, whilst the latter happens in a computer.

The weather is not 'climate'; the former happens...

Trooper Thompson said...

The mask is slipping. We need to rip it off and throw it back in their face. These people are nazi eugenic scum.

Mr A said...

Nice to see they appreciate that weather isn't climate. Shame they didn't have the same opinion when they were blaming the wet summer and the recent floods on climate change only a couple of weeks ago.

Criminals, the lot of them.

The Pedant-General said...

Yes, with the exception of this:
"it seems that many AGW alarmists simply don't agree!"

The alarmists do indeed agree with you: they recognise that democracy is the least worst way to maintain liberty. They are just coming at it from the other side: they don't want/like us to have liberty, so they need to undermine democracy.

Simples. :-)

Demetrius said...

Ve haff vays ov making you varm!

Anonymous said...

I am very dissapointed in the Japanese Imperial navy nowadays.
Now how do you think they would have reacted to the Greeny peace prank on the whaler had it been 50 years ago.
I am sure any survivors would have been beheaded ,Katana style.
Oh how I long for the good ole days.

Anonymous said...

I cannot see the terrorist angle.
But if there were a few of them mad enough to go down that road.
Any support they have would drop to practically ... 0
Animal rights campaigners are a good example of that particular backfire.

john in cheshire said...

I get the feeling that there are a lot of people, including myself, who see the evils in this world for what they are. They are reported on by bloggers and commented on by the readers of the blogs. What I don't see is any indication of a movement to oppose all this evil; whether it is the so-called green movement, socialism/marxism in genereral, or islam. Where are the vigilante movements and the action forces who are planning to drive the evil into the sea? And the patriots who are putting the plans into effect? Talk is cheap.

Tim Carpenter LPUK said...

"If you want a picture of the future, imagine a carbon footprint stamping on a human face -- forever."

Anonymous said...

Something for you to shred:

Call for Proposals - Town Twinning Citizens Meetings

The European Commission has announced the first call for proposals under its Town Twinning Initiative, which is part of the new Active Citizens for Europe Programme (2007 -2013). This call for proposals is under Action 1 - Measure 1.1 Town Twinning citizens meetings. Under this Measure grants of between €2,000 and €20,000 are available to support Town Twinning citizens meetings. Town twinning citizens' meetings consist in bringing together a wide range of citizens and citizens' groups from towns already twinned to; further develop strong, informal and personal relations between their citizens, to reinforce the participants' commitment to European integration; and to contribute to the development of an active European citizenship. To be eligible the applicant needs to be the municipality or its twinning association in which the meeting will take place. The deadline for applications is the 1st February 2010.

vervet said...

But what is the reason for this AGW bullsh1t?

Watch this and find out …

New World Order = World Government by big business.

George W. Bush > Barack Obama
Gordon Brown > David Cameron

Do you see it now ?

You MUST watch then you will understand.

Atlas shrugged said...

Where are the vigilante movements and the action forces who are planning to drive the evil into the sea? And the patriots who are putting the plans into effect? Talk is cheap.

Easy one.

Completely or adequately subverted, by one method, or another. Worthwhile questions would be, subverted by what, and for what ultimate Common Purpose?

The powers that have always controlled both democracy and communism, still control both. The only thing that has changed is that they long since decided to mix them up together some what. A subtle combination of Marx inspired Communism run by Capitalism, better known as Corporatism, or indeed Fascism, with all but the goose-stepping to go with it.

Randian nightmare, without a hero in sight.

Anonymous said...

I still think the backlash to the AGW lie and the rest of the NWO big gov scam will occur in the US .
Not in the NW section though ,but there are more than enough people there now who are seeing through it and do not like what they see.
Nor what they experience.
You have to remember the social engineering project started there so they have had longer to slowly simmer to the boil.

Middle Seaxe said...

Atlas Shrugged, another description could be "State capitalism". I was reading on Wiki (yes, yes, I know ;0)) that Lenin saw it as a "victory" to achieve that before total domination.

Murray Rothbard the American libertarian described it as

"a partnership of government and big business where the state is intervening on behalf of large capitalists against the interests of consumers.[24][25] He distinguishes this from laissez-faire capitalism where big business is not protected from market forces"

The above snipped from Wiki.

Pretty much describes Britain in the first days of 2010 I think.